Stargate SG-1 & Stargate Atlantis didn't take themselves seriously. For 10 years the franchise didn't take itself seriously. As I have seen every single episode, there were not one episode that didn't include a black joke. Richard Dean Anderson was good at making ones, but I am damn sure he should have used his skills in some movies and not wasting time in Stargate where last 5 seasons where more about keeping the team together than exploring different cultures. The idea that Earth was rescued zillion times from certain destruction shows that the show wasn't evolving in any direction. They had a galaxy, but instead the series was more about walking around in the base, helping Teal'c and wasting time with Tok'ra who were bunch of loosers and cowards. Teal'c should have had his own show called "Saving Private Teal'c". Doctor Jackson should have had his own show called "Explanation that I just pulled out of my ass". Samantha Carter should have had her own show called "Talk fast and press buttons".
Stargate Atlantis stopped being interesting after Teyla was introduced which was in the pilot. Teyla should have had her own show called "Saving my people". One may have liked doctor Rodney McKay, but no one could have liked Teyla. If I had the time, I would have cut out clips where she was talking. But she made strange facial expressions too. Was she high or what? The only thing they changed about her during 5 seasons is the line "My people" to "My child". Guess they paid her lesser because there are less letters in "child" than in "people". John Sheppard was such as a heroic peace and justice loving guy that you just wanted to cuddle her, sorry him.
Stargate Universe is more realistic. People are not just about peace and justice. Women are emotional. Survival changes our priorities. What happens to our moral when our survival is in danger? Do we keep talking about peace and justice or do we do something that we are not very proud of but is easier and less risky? Surviving is not a joke. Surviving lessons for every occasion are not something that we can write down. Surviving is not about exploring worlds and meeting civilizations to sign peace pacts. It is about who lives and who dies, who comes back in one piece and who stays behind as a warning for others "I was here and I couldn't handle it, you might not too!".
Why it is called Stargate Universe? Because the Stargate is what put them there. Stargate is not safe. It sends you god knows where and one must understand that he might travel for the last time. It isn't always fire power that kills people, it is also the nature itself. Just take away water and you die. Take away food and you die. Take away people and you go mad and die. See something horrific and you go mad and die. The "Destiny" is old and could brake into pieces any second they sit there. It could explode any second. It could start leaking oxygen any second. It could fly into star if it wants. It could crash into planet due to malfunction.
Stargate Universe is a different premise, in my honest opinion Stargate would not have lasted a lot longer if they didn't make a change. Just out of curiosity is the negativity you have towards it mostly because you don't like some aspects of the show or you were just still bitter about Atlantis while watching it, immediately came to the conclusion that it sucked without giving it a fair chance, picking on minor issues and turning small issues into 'major flaws' all to just strike back at TPTB that cancelled your beloved shows and more or less giving the middle finger to fans in the process?
I can't speak for anyone else, but as a fan of SG1 and SGA I gave SGU way more of a "fair chance" than I give most shows. Usually, I give a show one episode, MAYBE two, to hook me. If it hasn't hooked me by then, I will not watch any more. Because I was such a fan of SG1 and Atlantis, I gave SGU SEVEN full episodes to hook me - unfortunately, it didn't. I really wanted to like it, but I didn't.
I acknowledge differences is personal taste, and if you like SGU, then that's great for you. My negativity towards the show has nothing to do with Atlantis being cancelled. It has to do with two factors:
One - In my opinion, it is not a good show. I have varied tastes, and I actually quite enjoy dramas, so I was looking forward to a darker, more character-driven series (but still with some science fiction themes, of course). Unfortunately, SGU is not well-written, in my opinion. The pacing is WAY too slow. Drama does not have to be boring and slow. As an example, I recently started watching the drama Mercy, and I must say, the first episode hooked me within the first five minutes - and I couldn't stop watching. I watched all 15 episodes available on Hulu practically in one sitting. That is what good drama does - it pulls you in with flawed, yet still loveable characters and makes you want more. SGU has failed to do that for me, and for many others. I find most of the SGU characters too amoral and selfish for me to care about them, or to care what happens to them. The sex body swapping was the final straw for me. To me, there are major flaws, which is why I don't watch anymore. I am not really interested in debating what the flaws are, since opinions and tastes vary, but since you asked relatively nicely, and I was bored, I thought I would elaborate my own reasons for not liking SGU
The second factor for my negativity towards SGU, is the slap in the face that TPTB gave to the fans that supported the franchise over the years. Most significantly Malozzi in his blog rant about "idiot comments." In that post, Malozzi managed to insult both the prior versions of Stargate, the actors in them, the makeup artists, and all the fans that enjoyed those shows. If not for that attitude, I would probably be mourning the fact that SGU sucks all by my lonesome, but since TPTB have made it very clear what they think of the SG1 and SGA fanbase, I can't help but be angry at them. And so now I hope the show fails and I participate in this website. The primary intent is not to "give the middle finger" to SGU fans, but rather to give it to TPTB (and only because they gave it to us first!). Of course, SGU fans who come here and give us the finger, tend to get the same treatment right back at them. But anyone who behaves respectfully on the forum tends to receive respectful treatment back, whether they hate SGU or love it. At least, that's my interpretation of what goes on around here.
You were right about few things though but it is why I actually like Atlantis, not the other way around. To me Atlantis was best Stargate show ever.
You see....and the reason it being cancelled is more enough reasons, I mean SG1 was not cancelled because of Atlantis, nor they didn't stop producing movies, in this case it seems we will never see the movies, so I can only pull middlefinger at them. not only that, but SGU is really awfully cooked dish, as I said in other post:
"Anyway Staragte Universe is so wrong because it ripped like any sci-fi show plus ripping drama and other non sci-fi show. But that wouldn't matter much, only if they didn't rip all of the worse elements and mashed them together like a bad cook or bad bartender, which use remains of used food which the hosts didn't eat and mash them together and add more stuff, possibly with best before date already passed million years ahead. There was a certain satire movie made in Czechoslovakia (as I come from there as well, except today it is Czech republic and Slovakia separately), where there was this bartender who used the same stuff, he added even soap water to beer etc....it was hilarious. "
And as for the characters, they are joke and they are making people so hard to like them, in fact some beging to like them, but it is only wrong to do and as it was said, it is immoral, because even if I found character that was likeable, I am not him, but what they are trying to do is make it appeal more to the audience and majority of people because they think they are like them, that may be true, except that they are basically saying they approve of their behavior and that's what the guys over there are doing, it is so fucked up, but in the end really it only stirrs troubles around, because people are arguing if Rush is better or Young is better and basically they are doing the same what is going on in Destiny. You can try so hard to like the characters, but they are the worst characteraziation of human population, in fact it perfectly shows (or well it rather follows it, it is not warning about it) where the society is heading and what's wrong with it, you see it with these shows now. What the hell are they thinking? Actually it is even dangerous.
I forgot the exact words I wanted to word it out before, but that is beacuse I am tired atm....
IMO, SGU is not realistic, these are supposedly highly trained military and civilian professionals, only the best got to go to the Icarus base. Like someone said before, the only people that is the "wrong" person is Chloe and Camille. Everyone else there knew the dangers of going to Icarus. Now, if I was on that ship I wouldn't be whining and doing people, I'd try to find a way to get off this god-awful ship!
"I wouldn't say any stargate is better than no stargate at all because this isn't the stargate that we all know and love"
You've just summed up a few of the things that made Stargate good.
Nah, just not utilized by the writers properly.
In a Jerry Springer way, i suppose ...
But humor does make a great coping mechanism
Yeah, it's wangsting about marital issues and boyfriend problems. That's survival....
So you admit it's ties to the franchise are flimsy at best?
Yeah, because SG1/SGA never had people get killed by anything other than guns....
Oh it's way more than the premise that's different.
And seriously, if they were tried of the franchise formula, they should have called it quits, and done Universe as it's own show.
^ This, and your charactures of SG1 and SGA:
In reply to this post by Mitchelluva
If someone thinks the characters in SGU are "Realistic"? Damn, they must live in one scary neighborhood...
Thats a good thing.
I'd say if RDA would have been unhappy with the show, he would have left a LONG LONG time ago. Its not like he cant act in anything else.
Well, yeah, if they didn't rescue earth for the zillionth time, it would get destroyed and you could have EVEN MORE Battlegate SG1.
You could have your own show called "Talk shit and think you're intelligent", but that doesn't make for a compelling argument, or does it?
There are a lot of Teyla lovers, but i think shes was annoying as fuck, same with Ronon which was as entertaining as Chewbakka, but at least he had potential.
SGA had many problems, so did SG1, but none of them pretended to be flawless in the first place.
Breaking the 4th wall was commonplace, and hence the cheese wasn't so unbearable as in SGU where everything is supposed to be super-serious.
Mkay, you missed the part where he shot a his XO in the head?
Funny you'd say that because the last episode was called Justice, and S2 has the episode "Peace"
HOLY SHIT! STOP THE PRESS!
THIS JUST IN: WOMEN ARE EMOTIONAL!!!!11one
Yeah what happens then? Like that one time where we used a sentient race of machines to fight our war ignoring their right to live and think. Or that one time where we negotiated with Genii terrorists to get an edge over the Wraith.
Or maybe that one time where we tried to "cure" the Wraith of their personality and what they are?
Or that one time where we lied and betrayed the humanoid replicators from fear.
CERTAINLY NEVER ANSWERED IN SGA ORS SG1! *nudge nudge eyeroll*
Keep that awesome insight comming bro!
I never even fucking considered that! BRILLIANT!
The universe is out to get you!
Shit, this is some prime insight into the human psyche right there.
As i interpret it, you just said:
People can die!?
Holy Badonkles Batman!
You mean as Mallozzi and the writers want.
And lastly i agree, they needed a new show imo.
Let me get one thing straight here:
Im not Atlantis4Life, i dont give a rats shit about if SGA got canceled.
What i want is good SF.
If i dont get good SF, i go into RAGE mode.
If i see a franchise being raped, i go into RAGE mode.
If i see bad writing, i go, you guessed it, into RAGE mode.
In short SGU insults my intelligence, and i have watched a lot of mindless dribble in my time.
At least Power Rangers didn't pretend its DEEP and EDGY.
Other before me had deconstructed your diatribe more astutely, So I will not bother. People die everyday, as T’ealc would say, “indeed”. But People on SGU Will die, not by guns, but by STD’s
Yes, yes and yes. And if only SGU would deliver on that... I'd be thrilled to see whoever (even these SGU "wrong people") be on that ship and actually have to fight for survival. Throw them in a melting pot and have them up against each other genuinely concerned about who has the right or wrong ideas. Yes, please!
But as it is? We have earth plots half the time, taking a significant amount of pressure (and grittyness, as well as emotional involvement) right out of the thing. Spontaneous vacationing during a life threatening sitution is NOT realistic. Always having the out to run back and ask for expert opinion is NOT conductive to bulding or even maintaining the pressure of a survival situation. Coupled with a ship-mommy that will conveniently drop people off where they just need to grab whatever they need. All they have to do is to not be too stupid and too involved with themselves or their earth bickering dramas to actually grab it (lame try to keep pressure up via a running clock device not withstanding). Way to go with the realism there also.
In reply to this post by AdamTM
Hey, hey, hey! Teyla lover here! :P Teyla had lots of potential. It was the way the writers chose to write for her (or not write for her, depending on how you want to look at it) that was annoying as f**k.
I’ve complained about that myself. Only bad, bored, or stale writers that are losing their edge can take the leader of a new (to the SGA team) and different centuries-old civilization in another galaxy that is also a warrior that is skilled in combat, knows of and trades with other civilizations within that galaxy, has a connection to the known enemy race in the galaxy that gives her an advantage in fighting them, and is supposed to be wise, and is beautiful, and totally f**k it up by making her wallpaper that sometimes would ask dumb questions that didn’t really fit the description of what her character was supposed to be about.
But, we all have our own opinions, so I accept yours. :P
I agree that SGA/SG-1 had their problems, but like you said, they were never pretentious. In some cases, I think that’s what saved them when they were having problems. Overall, I still think they were pretty awesome. Of course, SGA is my favorite.
Thanks, buddy! You got my name right. LOL. But seriously, I don’t abhor SGU because Atlantis was cancelled. If that were the case, then I would have never watched the show because I would have already hated it and had no need to see it to feel that way.
To get it straight, here’s what happened: Atlantis was cancelled, and yes, I wasn’t happy about it. But then they said there would be movies (or at least a movie) so, I felt like, “Okay, fine.”
Then they said that they were coming out with SGU. Again, I was like “Okay, fine.”
Then, I watched the new Stargate show to see what it was going to be like. And that’s when I had the same reaction that a lot of people have had. I thought “They cancelled SGA for THIS???” Still, if it had’ve just been a bad show, then I just would have moved on like I normally do when I see something I don’t like.
Then came the “rant,“ the comments and behavior from the producers, and the negative spin that TPTB were trying to put out against SG-1/SGA AND their fans. That was when I was like wtf? These guys AND their terrible show need to fail. And it’s not like we’re getting the movies. Sure, there’s the tiniest bit of hope for that, but realistically, it seems really unlikely to me that they’re coming.
So, I also don’t fit Binar’s (welcome Binar ) statement about just being bitter about Atlantis and not giving SGU a fair chance. But if that’s what he wants to believe, then okay.
I personally believe that "You're just bitter over Atlantis and never gave SGU a chance" is just something that TPTB came up with as an excuse for SGU not premiering to better numbers than it did, and pro-SGU followers are just reciting it verbatim. It was supposed to get better numbers than Atlantis for the premiere, and it didn't. All I ever read or hear about is people that gave SGU more of a chance beacuse it had the name Stargate in it, and that it probably would be doing even worse right now if it didn't.
I agree with you that SGU is an insult to SF, intelligence, etc. *Thumbs up on that one*
Bring Atlantis Back!!!
SG became a famous brand because it had a formula that worked, now it doesn't, it's not about "serious", if SG1 was made like SGU, SG the brand simply wouldn't survive the last decade.
And no, people don't want "realistic", It's clear you don't have the brain cell to understand the entertainment industry. People watch shows to escape their real life, that's why in movies fuel tank always explodes when fired upon, people drop after a single knock on the back of the head, women are always hot, and bad guys always lose in the end, the list goes on and on.
It happens not because it is "realistic", but because this is what most people want to see, it's in the DNA.
But that is not even it, SGU is no where near realistic by any means, if you call SGU realistic then you simply haven't got the SLIGHTEST idea how people in the real world operate.
All SGU tried to do was invent its own "reality", one which doesn't resemble anything from the real world we live in, nor the Hollywood reality people accept on tv and movies.
Let's begin with real world realistic:
1. When the room is dark the first thing people do is switch on the fucking lights.
2. When there is not enough oxygen, people will desperately check every room looking for supplies by all means necessary, instead of staying in one room arguing for hours.
3. Emotional do-nothing-but-scream-a-lots simply wouldn't be allowed to get anywhere near the program the first place.
Now for Hollywood realistic, I'll take the ep where they went to get lime stones for the air filter (or whatever bs it was,cbf looking it up):
1. The ship's technology is xxxxxxx years a head of human's, some how it forgot to switch life support system off when no one was on there.
2. The ship knew where the lime stone was, the ship is huge, with a million docks and pieces sticking out, it's so "advanced" it can fly into a star to recharge but somehow it didn't have a drone to do all the labor work automatically.
3. The ship had beaming technology, but it didn't know how to scan the planet and beam a block of lime up onto the ship? FUCK OFF.
There are good realistic and bad realistic, SGU is neither, SGU pretends to be, so losers like you can jump from one delusion to another.
And when people talk about survival, people think battles, people think excitements, people don't think girly whining who screams louder soap drama, intergalactic wife swap, go clubbing then cry in a car, while time and resource is limited and life is at stake.
Somehow the morons who wrote SGU and the idiots who enjoy it thinks they can redefine what survival is - Fucking around when it matters.
In the real world pathetic shows like this get slammed. And in my honest opinion you have no idea how the real world works and is simply posting bullshits because you either got paid to do so, or just can't accept the fact that you have really bad taste and logic.
[Bows deeply to Spaceman XIII], , You Sir, are my new god.. Hallowed is Spaceman XIII!!!, For he shall call all wankers to task, and de-mystify these logical situations, to the lame brained and the retarded.
Loved the comment: 3. The ship had beaming technology, but it didn't know how to scan the planet and beam a block of lime up onto the ship? FUCK OFF.
In reply to this post by Atlantis4Life
Just to make it clear, i did not intend to insult you or anything.
I just wanted to point out to him that im not going to dance around a troll doing the argument-hokeypokey.
I just used you as an example, as your posts are mostly civil and well structured.
Mine, on the other hand, are not.
In reply to this post by US06154
Thank you, thank you, just doing my part in this war on garbage.
you have won a prize
This guys gonna have a fun read when he gets back
"I wouldn't say any stargate is better than no stargate at all because this isn't the stargate that we all know and love"
[quote]Surviving is not a joke[/quote]
You are right, surviving isn't a joke - but it makes more sense with humor. Some years ago I was in a situation to fight for survival. And I only made it because of my humor. It was one of the hardest times in my life but one thing helped me leave it behind: laughing.
So don't tell me sgu is realistic, it isn't. In a situation like that you don't have the time for cry und be worry about how far your home is, you only can fight - and you can laugh. In other ways it will drive you crazy. Sorry but sgu is nothing then pathetic crap for me.
Think I should put it in a sig:
Sorry for my bad English!
Spaceman XIII FTW.
What exactly is realistic about any aspect of Stargate Universe, or any Stargate series for that matter? Have you been out that far into the universe to say, first hand, that it's "so much like the real thing"?
Perhaps you've actually taken a walk through a Stargate yourself? Maybe you picked up a rock one day as you walked down the street and instantly found yourself occupying someone else's body somewhere in the universe. Oh! I know! You flew a ship through our sun's corona and refilled your piss-tank fuel cells instead of vaporizing!
Now that we've dismissed the "realistic" aspect of the sci-fi part, which, as I've mentioned before, you just enjoy and suspend belief, let's look at the drama.
You're on a giant raft floating in the cosmos with no food, no water, no control of its direction, no knowledge of your environment, no hope of getting back home that is a billion light years away (meaning it takes a billion years for light to travel from where they are currently to home), yet their concerns and priorities have little to do with survival. Instead, they bicker, whine, bitch and concern themselves with absolute stupidities with about the same level of emotion and conflict as if they were just stuck at the train station.
The stones - probably the most important and powerful piece of tech at their disposal which they can use to bring on board true experts instead of solely relying on Dr Jekyll's "expertise", opting instead to use them as weekend getaway vehicles home so they can do the backside bachata, get high, and generally do nothing of any consequence. Think of being stranded at sea on a ship with a working radio but using it to "meet chicks" and having "CB sex" instead of calling for help.
Yeah, how "realistic".
The drama is the only element that could have had some form of realism and even that breaks down to sheer "me too! me too!" writing penis envy by washed up writers trying to do drama where it doesn't belong. Their "drama" is nothing but a huge clusterf*ck and bears no realism whatsoever to how a group of stranded people would behave.
Perhaps you've actually taken a walk through a Stargate yourself? Maybe you picked up a rock one day as you walked down the street and instantly found yourself occupying someone else's body somewhere in the universe.
nice one - fucking brilliant
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